Curse

Charr Killer · Oct 11, 2005, 12:31 AM // 00:31

Im all for it Im trying to get money to make a guild with my school friends

BUT: points for guilds should be divided by the # of members becuz then the big guilds would have to do like 1 quest each to beat a small guild that beats like all the quests

Iere · Oct 11, 2005, 12:41 AM // 00:41

Yes please.

My guild currently consists of anyone who wants my monking ability. ^^; We really only play PvE, if only because we don't have enough people, but we have a damn fun time doing it. I've had my best times helping out a friend with getting through the crystal desert, etc.

I'd really, really enjoy this. It would give me a chance to actually feel worth something without Vent or TS. >>

Perishiko ReLLiK · Oct 11, 2005, 02:55 AM // 02:55

Everybody else is being so complex with their answers.

I have a few things to say. Guild wars is about the guild wars that happened in the past, and happened a little through the story line, revealing things.

The pve is far from complete as it is. The new chapters will be doubling your experience, and more than likely they'll be adding more "elite" area's such as their newest addition. (Guilds can find fun with that, since "pug" for the titan quests suck, and the henchies aren't useable). Not only that, but they'll probably add more levels for the extra "avatars" in the temple of ages.

Not only all this, but they decided 8v8 teams to be the max, because any more than that and you'll have just a massive amount of no strategy. There was talk of having bigger teams, but we'll just have to wait and see to be sure.

And to top it all off, i think this idea sucks.

Nigy · Oct 11, 2005, 03:38 AM // 03:38

i like...the concept a lot being a very pve guy...

Zhou Feng · Oct 11, 2005, 08:57 AM // 08:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Selden

Now, in all my suggestions I will try to have some emphasis on "what is the purpose" of having xyz vs. doing something because its cool, example, "I should have my own house in an outpost", then the question is "And what purpose does that serve?".

So, here I go.....

I've been a guild leader for 3 weeks for a fast growing guild. I find that many love PVE and aren't good or don't care for PvP, but, realize PVE has its limits eventually....so, the following will focus on extending PVE. The game is called "Guild Wars", but the only war is the actual physical fight of one guild vs. the next. The other war, the bigger one, is, which guild is the most popular, wise, friendly, courageous and adventurous... all leading to a score of SUCCESS.

NEW GUILD LADDER

A separate Guild Ladder focused on PVE
This would include a system that gives new ratings to the guild leader, and to all players. These ratings are the core focus of those playing PVE since XP of course has its limits. And, these ratings are the core focus and purpose for those in a guild without its majority playing PvP.

A-Counters for
1. "qty of elite skills captured per member of guild"
2. "qty of boss's killed (1 kill per boss) per guild member"
3. "qty of runes/upgrades unlocked per guild member"
4. "qty of missions/bonus completed, with extra points for bonus per guild member"
5. "qty of ascended players per guild"
6. "qty of quests completed per guild member"
7. "qty of ascended profession combinations and derivatives of this kind of counter"
8. "percentage of maps explored and cleared per guild member"
9. "qty of deaths per member....yes, some incentive to NOT die"

B - Algorithms for (to prevent spamming the score in some way with the above counters)
1. "members amount of time spent questing with guild members"
2. "members amount of time spent questing with non members who become members"
3. "amount of time a member has been in the guild"
4. "percentage of party size that includes guild members and frequency of that"
5. "a check for all of the above counters where those events take place during the members active guild" vs. bringing those counters to the guild from another guild)

C - Outcome (what gets displayed to end users)
1. Trophy Room in the Guild Hall (shows each boss killed as a trophy, and which are left, which are the current target/mission selected by leaders/officers)
2. Adventurers Room (shows scroll or scribe on the wall of a listing of the NPC's which gave quests and that they have been completed)
3. Missions Room (similar to adventures room, but obviously with emphasis on missions/bonus's)
4. Members Room (shows a plaque with members/officers name and current mug shot) also shows ratings/scores for the various stated algorithms
5. As the mentioned rooms fill up, points are achived, those points can be exchanged for customization of the guild hall.... gold trim, custom banners, room upgrades ect. Anything that currently exists can be improved some how and as well things can be added as long as they don't effect the outcome of gvg battles (but they should still be visible in gvg).
6. In the Trophy Room, Adventures Room, Missions Room
Subcounters to visually display the outcome of the already stated algorithms. Such as a teamwork rating that uses the stated algorithms to show the teamwork score/points.

D - A couple of things that need to happen to support this...
1. More quests would be nice, and dynamic as well, based off what answers you gave the NPC's, somewhat like what NWN did (of course GW Chars don't have those attributes)
2. Ability to allow non members to tour the hall for a specific amount of time to see rooms and status of the guild
3. Lore, more of it....much more obscure and odd quests that tie into eachother over long periods of time, like Gwen. Make it really worth spending 2 hours to get to a place that has no outposts to take a brake at.

Obviously I can get much more granular than this.......but hey, I don't work for ArenaNet, and I need to actually get back to work before I get fired!

PS: These suggestions are of course for a major version release vs a patch...but...I think it could all be done with a patch as well, given enough time.
PSS: One small thing that can be done now, separate from this entire post....allow me to see current quests completed!

Marc Miles (Kirkland Wa)
InGame (Selden Meliorate)
Guild "Consort Of Simpatico Carnage" CoSC
http://www.guilduniverse.com/cosc/

Sounds good. Is this idea all pve based without the gvg and such?

Megumiko · Oct 11, 2005, 05:20 PM // 17:20

though I think it should be based on something like the PvE arena idea, with some of the OP concepts like number of character that ascended within the guild adding to the points.

One thing that should be kept in mind for all nay sayers is that a PvE Guild ladder would be seperate from a PvP Guild ladder though it would be possible to have guilds on both.

I am all for increasing the rewards for PvE players to have a guild, aside from a chat channel for all of your friends. I generally don't like PvP (unless it's with my friend) because of the trash-talking, poor sportsman attitudes that one finds in it.

Most of the people in our guild could care less about PvP. We went and bought ourselves a hall just to have one, but no one goes there.

Crispy and others, you've said yourselves that the PvE part of the game was meant to draw a certain type of players into the game. Is it wrong then, to not implement ideas to keep those same players in the game?

After all, Arena-net has lsitened to PvPers who weren't interested in PvE and made it easier for those people to get things to make themselves more powerful. In fact, Gail Grey just said in an interview that they are considering ways to make it easier for PvPers to level outside of PvE.

Conversely they should look at ways to make Guild Halls, and Guilds themselves more useful for the PvE-ers.

Zhou Feng · Oct 11, 2005, 06:20 PM // 18:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by PieXags

Yes Silmor we all know that it's named that because of the story line and most of us problably don't really care why it was named that. If the "guild wars" ended do you mind telling me why the hell guilds still fight in their guild halls? How does that fit into the storyline? Do they do it just for the hell of it? Are they just skirmishing because they've nothing else to do? That's just...bland.

Though even though I don't like the current system of PvP I am not for this.

I'm not concerned about rank I'm concerned about fun and my ability to do something in this game, adding more titles and trophies to PvE isn't going to do anything but add some text to some guilds. I'm not all about that. See it's not that I enjoy just "PvE" or "farming" I just don't have anything else to do in the game, and that aggrivates me. Large scale PvP battles that don't end like "arena" battles, just battles that keep going, a war is what I'd say would be the best solution, more fun, even for PvE players I'd say who don't care about "rank" or "faction" just so that they can have fun feeling like their fighting for a side in a battle you can get immersed in.

While I don't really see a reason not to have it, a rank or title is what out of all this game has to offer, I'm least concerned about. I don't care if I'm last ranked or first ranked it's about being able to have fun that matters to me.

Seriously if Guild Wars implemented something more to the politics of Guilds AND why they clash, maybe some sort of influence that the Guilds can have and perhaps Guild politics of obtaining Sub Guilds or Allied Guilds and then going out to war with other Guilds,Sub Guilds Allied Guilds in larger scale combat with bigger gvg maps... maybe itd be interesting. Political maneouvering of diplomacy, guild resources to wage war and protect the hall...

For example to take out a bigger stronger guild three guilds can make a truce and band together for a common goal. But once that guild is knocked out maybe treachery ensues between these three guilds. Or maybe they form into a new guild.

I think with Guilds there is a lot of possibilities to exploit other then just combat.

Mordakai · Oct 26, 2005, 01:41 PM // 13:41

Eventually, I'd like the Guild Halls to evolve into Castles, with sieges, etc.

But this may be way beyond the capacities of a Free Game.

But even without a PvE Guild Ladder, having a trophy rack in your Guild (for mission completed by just Guild member, for ex), or some other customization available would be a great idea!

Pompeyfan · Oct 26, 2005, 06:17 PM // 18:17

I'm all for anything to improve the PvE side of GW as it's sortely lacking atm, and one poster was right in saying it can getting boring after a while. Personally I don't give a rats ass whether it's mean't to be PVP only or not, the ganme has a PvE side and lot (my self included) bought it to play that and don't have any interest in PVP so those players should get recognition and an equal chance for rewards - the opinion of PvP's and farmers that they deserve all the rewards is just selfisness on their part.

Personally I'm not bothered about having the guild I'm in recognised, we don't actively recruit and membership is invitation only, if we like the person having chatted/quested with them we'll ask them to join - we'd rather have a new player who is helpful and friendly than the best player in the game who is an obnoxious toerag. We do havbe some members that enjoy PvP and GvG and a few who don't, as long as everyone has fun (and it is only a game after all) then thats what matters.

The main change I'd like to see to the PvE side is more substantial rewards for completing quests than useless XP and skill points (yes useless when you have all the skills/elites you want or need). Perhaps on completing a high level quest, there should be a rare item given as a reward or some of the materials needed for fissure armour - wouldn't affect PvPer's at all as they'd still get their rewards from PvPing, This would also have the knock-on effect to improve what is currentrly killing the PvE side - getting a party to do the quests, as all you tend to see are groups forming who want warriors/monk's/ele's to farm, but if there were decent rewards for quest completion then that'd become more popular and those that like farming could still do so.

ghezbora · Dec 21, 2005, 04:00 PM // 16:00

There should definitely be a PVE ladder in addition to the PVP ladder. As others have already countered to the nay-sayers: this doesn't affect PVP in any way.

I think, though, it's important to NOT base it on bosses killed / characters ascended / quests completed. It needs to be completely separated from number of players and from hours played. That (a) gives too much edge to incumbant, large guilds and (b) promotes grind.

It should, instead, be based on skill. Just like PVP, if someone hooks up with seven friends and they all buy the game, they can go straight to Tombs and win the HoH. Granted, that's probably never happened, but it could. The difference would be you'd be using PVE characters, so you would have to level them first, so not quite the same jump-in quickness, but the based-on-skill mantra still stands.

The PVE Arena accomplishes this. Tactical's idea of duration survived works well, or you could have a certain set of goals and the guild that completes it fastest wins, or the team that manages to accomplish the most of the goals given. PVE is by nature the same every time, so a metric like time works very well. Teams can try again and again, shaving seconds off their time in the same engagement (or surviving additional waves). Constant doesn't mean easy.

And of course there could be multiple arenas, and there could be PUG arenas in addition to guild ones (PUG arenas could generate individual PVE rank similar to the PVP fame/rank). I'd love to see a similar setup to PVP where there's a team, guild, and a random arena.

This lets PVE players and guilds that want the competetive edge go to the arenas and try their hand, and have something to show for it, and it lets PVE players have some way to measure PVE guilds the way PVP players do. It's merely an addition, no one who doesn't like it is forced to use it in any way.

Lucifer · Dec 21, 2005, 04:51 PM // 16:51

no offense, but the idea for a pve ladder is dumb...
wanna be on a ladder? go pvp
u pve people just want it because its to hard to get on the pvp ladder
and why is that? because u dont want to do anything to accomplish that
How the hell do u think every pvp guild started out? (not iway and ranger spike pussies btw)
We THINK a build up, and PRACTISE with it.
Tombs is your playground, why dont u go there and practise how this game works against real teams instead of bot bosses?
If u win, hey heres some fame, if u lose, u lose nothing
Then if your confident, go play gvg, and stop whining about 'pvp ladder is weak and wrong and all the crap'
because it isnt

fiery · Dec 21, 2005, 05:01 PM // 17:01

i say take away AI build from UW in PVE.. and add more slots to the guild

Quote:

u pve people just want it because its to hard to get on the pvp ladder
and why is that? because u dont want to do anything to accomplish that

that is the most BULL i ever heard... Pve people dont wanna mess with PVP and the ladder..TRUE.but not always the case some PVE go into the PVP places TA/CA/Tombs/GVG.. but Pve is way harder than PVP.. u start of PVE to gain items/skills.. in PVP you go in with a pre build saying alrite i kill stuff i buy skills... PVE you go into the game.. you do quests.. you cap skills.. you buy skills... you buy/work/farm/gather materials for your items..PVE is the building steps for PVP. the ladder is nothing.

Quote:

Seriously if Guild Wars implemented something more to the politics of Guilds AND why they clash, maybe some sort of influence that the Guilds can have and perhaps Guild politics of obtaining Sub Guilds or Allied Guilds and then going out to war with other Guilds,Sub Guilds Allied Guilds in larger scale combat with bigger gvg maps... maybe itd be interesting. Political maneouvering of diplomacy, guild resources to wage war and protect the hall...

everyone welcome out president of GW.. woot.. guilds clash cause they are guilds.plain as the eye can see. SUB guilds ALLIED guilds.. they are known as sister guilds and its easy.. get ya leader to get with another guild leader and TA DA..i would think 16 vs 16 would be a bit much diplomacy/guild resources/wage war/protect the war...whose gunna be the bum staying at hall 24/7 defending it.. o crap.. i got school next day go defend the hall...and you dont go to sleep gather resources..the Halls are good as they can be.. an improvement yes is new maps.

Lucifer · Dec 21, 2005, 05:12 PM // 17:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiery

i say take away AI build from UW in PVE.. and add more slots to the guild

that is the most BULL i ever heard... Pve people dont wanna mess with PVP and the ladder..TRUE.but not always the case some PVE go into the PVP places TA/CA/Tombs/GVG.. but Pve is way harder than PVP.. u start of PVE to gain items/skills.. in PVP you go in with a pre build saying alrite i kill stuff i buy skills... PVE you go into the game.. you do quests.. you cap skills.. you buy skills... you buy/work/farm/gather materials for your items..PVE is the building steps for PVP. the ladder is nothing.

PVE is way harder than PVP, i mean, lmao, come on, be serious, whats harder?
fighting a rank 100 guild (just example) or getting through ANY mission?
Pre build? lmao, make your own character... heard of it.. u sound like every pvp player takes one of the templates (paladin ftw)
PVE is the building steps for PVP?????? to get good at PVP, u PVP, and alot, and then even more, whats there to learn in pve? to use i will avenge u without allied corpses? or other stupidities like that?
(btw i dont consider TA and CA as real pvp)

fiery · Dec 21, 2005, 05:14 PM // 17:14

on a side note the guy who made this post.. knowing how many times u died.. how many hours..when you joined... press G hover over the names.. pres H hover around.. do /age do /deaths. doubt u really need a ladder to knwo all this?

as for the quote to allow non members come into your hall.. its called Guesting them.

Quote:

PVE is way harder than PVP, i mean, lmao, come on, be serious, whats harder?
fighting a rank 100 guild (just example) or getting through ANY mission?
Pre build? lmao, make your own character... heard of it.. u sound like every pvp player takes one of the templates (paladin ftw)
PVE is the building steps for PVP?????? to get good at PVP, u PVP, and alot, and then even more, whats there to learn in pve? to use i will avenge u without allied corpses? or other stupidities like that?
(btw i dont consider TA and CA as real pvp)

you do PVE to get those skills and items you GET in PVP.. you do PVE is the backbone of PVP.. if you are new to the game..as many are.. they go straight to PVP hoping o sweet im owning this game.. to in fact many are still new.. PVE is the way to do PVP.. without PVE you would do 24/7 CA/TA/Tombs/GVG not knowing you had another way to gain items...doing PVP 24/7 even gets old who wants to click on a target..and press 1.3..4...o crap res....7...6....kill ghost hero.

and so wut if the guild is rank 100.. if your guild and your build is good.. why bother with rank.. you lose say gg..you win say gg.. wuts the diffrence? are you fretting? are your scared? that a rank 100 is against you? are you gunna say all crap we doomed..lets just leave...rank is the ladder that shows how good they are..there are rank 1000+ guilds that are old guild reforming..have you heard of smurf guilds..

and when i say prebuild...isnt it weird you bash at my point..yet you say PALLIDIN FTW?

Quote:

to get good at PVP, u PVP, and alot, and then even more, whats there to learn in pve?

how can you get good at PVP if all you have is ya basic skills..not knwoing what your doing.. thinking o sweet just pick a charc start pressing randomly..yes you gain PVP experience doing PVP..but some dont...whats there to learn in PVE??? EVERYTHING..shows how and what some skills work and do....you cant go into PVP.. grab a PALLIDIN...win some buy eviscreate and say.. why cant i use this? i wonder why.. maybe if you did PVE it would help...or read the descripion either way.. PVP are those going into a game whacking and slashing.. I myself do PVE and PVP.. so i know the standings on both side..and everyone should do PVE before moving onto PVP..PVE is the backbone. i dunno imma play with my fat gameboy brought it to school..classic owns.

Eugaet · Dec 21, 2005, 05:59 PM // 17:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Selden

So, here I go.....

Sounds like you've got a good idea. I'll reread through your post and give an actual response later, when I'm not at work. But for now, /signed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tactical-Dillusions

A PvE arena. You alone, with friends, PUGs or a Guild team start in an arena and you face "Everlasting" waves of monster attacks.

Definitely /signed. I used to see how long I could last on the Great Northern Wall mission if I just met the Charr head-on instead of running from them. Something like that would be hella fun. Would the monsters increase in difficulty as time passed? I would think they should. Can't remember if you mentioned that or not...I'll go back and check...

Lucifer · Dec 21, 2005, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiery

and so wut if the guild is rank 100.. if your guild and your build is good.. why bother with rank.. you lose say gg..you win say gg.. wuts the diffrence? are you fretting? are your scared? that a rank 100 is against you? are you gunna say all crap we doomed..lets just leave...rank is the ladder that shows how good they are..there are rank 1000+ guilds that are old guild reforming..have you heard of smurf guilds..

and when i say prebuild...isnt it weird you bash at my point..yet you say PALLIDIN FTW?

Paladin ftw = sarcasm because everybody that knows SOMETHING about this game knows that its the worst build ever (maybe not THE worst but one of the...)

Yes i heard of smurf guilds, i gvg'd against them, how about u?
im not saying that all the ranked guilds are better then the unranked guilds because obviously there are tombs only guilds, but im saying that if u make the top 100 your bound to be a bit better then alot of other guilds. if u dont believe me on that, try to make your way to top 100 yourself and then talk back to me.

And seriously, pve doesnt learn u a thing, and how u present pvp with 1, 2, 3 rez, skill 6, 7, shows to me that you arent better then the people that actually use the paladin template.
Im not going to respond any further, i dont want to be banned for flaming because its hard to explain to dumb people where they are wrong (yes i called u dumb, i know...)

actionjack · Dec 21, 2005, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Yes.. Guild need to be lot more in Guild Wars...

ghezbora · Dec 21, 2005, 09:48 PM // 21:48

Please don't feed the troll. Any discussion of PVP is harder than PVE or vice versa or anything like that is completely irrelevant to whether or not a PVE ladder is a good idea and/or how to implement it.

PVE players would like a ladder, as evidenced by the fact this thread exists.

If you PVP-only players think we're sissies, that's fine, I really couldn't care less what you think of me. Please go back to your PVP and enjoy it. I mean it, have fun, that's what the game is about: having fun. But please don't begrudge me trying to do the same.

Kool Pajamas · Dec 22, 2005, 12:15 AM // 00:15

I cant stand all this "either or" stuff. Lots of people play BOTH pve and pvp. They play palladin and mesmers. They play everything. Why should only the pvp part get the special attention?

Jas · Dec 30, 2005, 02:04 AM // 02:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anarchist_Monk

Adding titles and "ranks" to PvE would make it better, it would be just like the PvPers have except a little more complex. But hey we PvEers got time if we already beat the game and are tired of UW and Fissures.

That would be something... *blank stare to the wall while imagining*... "Your highness, Duchess Anilya, would you please join our humble company to assist us on a potentially perilous adventure to fight our way to Piken Square"

How could I resist LOLOLOL....

But seriously... it would be nice to see who has been around for long and who has not. It doesn't help, if you try to see who's got Drok's armor or not, as every freakin' noob with a credit card buys the money from eBay or such and gets a run there. But if you would get a Title according to /age or Missions+bonuses accomplished... that could add something new to the game but wouldn't make it inbalanced in any way.

Though... people would be asking me directions/hints to do the missions... and I still get lost in Ascalon